SC22/WG20 N1025
From: Alain LaBonté [alb@sct1.gouv.qc.ca]
Sent: Tuesday, April 01, 2003 11:07 AM
To: Bruno Von Niman (EBC)
Cc: sc22wg20@dkuug.dk; FRANCE.LAFARGUE@afnor.fr
Subject: Virus Warning: (SC22WG20.4558) Fwd: ETSI STF202 Character
assignment for 12-key telephone keypad (telecommunications standard)
Bruno,
here are my remarks (as ISO project editor) on this proposed ETSI standard:
1) In Annex B, please note that ISO/IEC 14651 (International Ordering Standard)
is not in the publication phase, as its first edition has been published in
2001 as a full-fledged International Standard. We are at its amendment 1 (which
is mainly an update of the table to take into consideration new
characters added in the universal character sets). Amendment 2 development (of
the same nature) is about to begin this summer. ISO/IEC 14651 is a major
international standard of which all other ordering standards in the world can
constitute profiles called "deltas". ISO/IEC 14651 should be quoted
in section 2, References, and not only in Annex B.
A note in 5.1 should be added to say that ordering of letters as documented in
this standard is necessary and very useful for standard letter assignment for
digits of a numeric keypad, but is it not generally sufficient to produce a
sorted list of different alphanumeric strings that humans can intuitively use
in any language (including English). One application should refer to ISO/IEC
14651 as the worldwide-recognized state-of-the-art way to do so more correctly.
Ordering achieved using the proposed ETSI STF202 standard will produce very
rough ordering results that may and will most certainly mislead end-users and
even computer specialists, according to my own experience in this matter.
In 5.2 it is wrong to specify alphabetic ordering of a list of character
strings where special characters are intersorted with letters and digits
without ample precautions. One should rather refer to ISO/IEC 14651, again.
2) In French Ï (I DIAERESIS) is a type-A letter (according to the definition of
type-A letter in the ETSI project of standard), necessary to correctly spell
words such as « ambiguïté ». It is certainly not a type-B letter.
3) Although this is discussable (since their use is rare) I would classify Y
DIAERESISes as type-A characters in French as there is no alternative to write
French literature without it (which is *not* the same case as æ, for which
there are alternate spellings [ex. : cæsium can be spelled césium],
as well as the ñ of the borrowed word cañon, whose alternate spelling is
canyon).
4) O DIAERESIS should be listed as a type-A letter in French (it is not listed
at all), at worst a TYPE-B, as it is used to spell a French noun, « angström »
(which is only a French spelling because it is a misspelling of the original proper
name, written with an Å, like its symbol in the metric system). There is no
alternate spelling for this word in French.
5) In 7.2 a note should be added to say : « "unique names of ISO/IEC
10646" are contextually unique in each language version of the standard.
They are used for the conceptual conciliation of different coded character sets
together. There is also a French version of this International standard. There
are registered character sets in the ISO registry that are documented with
French names only. Names can and should be translated in the user's language
when presented to end-users ».
Throughout the document the "-1" of 10646-1 should be removed. Firts,
there exists a -2 as of today, but it has been decided that both parts will be
merged in the near future.
In the introduction and in annex B should be quoted precisely: ISO/IEC 9995-8,
on assignment of letters to a numeric keypad and representations should be done
to extend this international standard to avoid having two standards in use internationally.
Best Regards.
Alain LaBonté
Project editor, ISO/IEC 9995 series of international standards (8 parts --
Keyboard Layouts [part 8 is on letter assigment
of numbers on a numeric keypad])
Project editor, ISO/IEC 14651 (Ordering and Character String comparison
standard)
Secrétariat du Conseil du trésor du Québec
Direction de l'architecture et de l'infrastructure
1500-H, rue Jean-Talon Nord
1er étage, porte 1.26, boîte n° 1
Ste-Foy (Québec) G1N 4T5 Canada
Téléphone : +1 418 528 6144
Télécopieur : +1 418 646 3571
____________________________________________________________
From: "Bruno Von Niman (EBC)"
<Bruno.VonNiman@ebc.ericsson.se>
To: Long distribution list,
Subject: ETSI STF202 Character standard- request for final comments
Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 14:41:42 +0100
Importance: high
X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2655.55)
inbrfwd: 1
Dear Colleagues,
We, ETSI Specialist Task Force 202, are in the process of developing a new
telecommunications standard in ETSI, addressing 12-key telephone keypads:
"Human Factors; User Interfaces: Character repertoires, ordering and
assignment to the 12-key telephone keypad (European languages)". The work
is approaching it's final phase, see<http://portal.etsi.org/STFs/HF/STF202.asp>
for further details.
A key aim of the work is to ensure a quick uptake of this beneficiary standard,
simplifying for both end users and manufacturers.
We have achieved a stable, fairly complete draft of the attached ES. Given the
detail-richness of the document addressing 27 languages, we would like to make
sure that the language-specific content is fully correct, the logic of the
document understandable, etc. We simply need more eyes to go through it
and comment it, on the detailed level.
<<DES_202130v36Mar26_2003.zip>>
We would kindly ask you to provide your formal informal comments (or a
confirmation of your agreement to it) not later than by May 5, 2003. Please
send them to hf_keys@list.etsi.org
Best regards,
Bruno
_______________________________________________
<<...OLE_Obj...>>
Bruno von Niman M.Sc.
ETSI STF202 Leader
End User Applications & Terminals
Specialist Team Leader Human Factors & Usability
Mobile Solutions, Systems & Technologies Management
Ericsson Enterprise AB
Augustendalsv. 21, Nacka Strand
SE- 131 89 STOCKHOLM
Sweden