From owner-sc22wg5+sc22wg5-dom9=www.open-std.org@open-std.org Wed Apr 29 14:54:01 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sc22wg5-dom9 Delivered-To: sc22wg5-dom9@www.open-std.org Received: by www.open-std.org (Postfix, from userid 521) id 96C0C9DB116; Wed, 29 Apr 2020 14:54:01 +0200 (CEST) Delivered-To: sc22wg5@open-std.org X-Greylist: delayed 429 seconds by postgrey-1.34 at www5.open-std.org; Wed, 29 Apr 2020 14:54:00 CEST Received: from mta01.ornl.gov (mta01.ornl.gov [128.219.177.137]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by www.open-std.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07CBB3566A9 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 2020 14:54:00 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ornl.gov; i=@ornl.gov; q=dns/txt; s=p20151116; t=1588164842; x=1619700842; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:mime-version: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Abhfx1o9ZWJIQusnQucrLZtc+e3/S4kRv2QS12uG0ho=; b=PBCPskKiTciHpeN1lZNzufXHucoxGwDnar//mRyeEvc5y5jOQkSq9OWg 5YioYHt4zOM/A/r7BDeCeZHlI1jyrORTeuvM1en6VmlH9uzpLBFbTyAt8 LZ1xVyTS7hNNowNFx55jFeKvGtUwXt68QkxCQb5jqkoaUiMdLcFQVJ6Fa G/VN0FPX+/Xnafgtshl8DAFbRdIJu8Je9fTg9AFXT3/XK+vxli7lpQib4 pbjAUVrfSRbn/fY+1L4pAoKCCczss/8IXNLbG0bS+OxMIaD3afA3sIwfX TFyKcPLuRCvU+PTmwP2SggRF1qEqn5GbgxDPuF7OIJprDhRSjJvvnzY7k Q==; IronPort-SDR: c+siYTxH2DvRDf7ZxIL5qEgsyFA+IyqD/ZU8SNCfeDcIQY5Q5eDJ51XUXtMZMz03JtudsA/GTj FmeVRQWR7M7w== X-SG: RELAYLIST X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.73,332,1583211600"; d="scan'208";a="94914830" Received: from emgwy2.ornl.gov ([160.91.254.10]) by iron1.ornl.gov with ESMTP/TLS/ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 29 Apr 2020 08:46:49 -0400 Received: from [0.0.0.0] (stargazer.ornl.gov [160.91.217.44]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by emgwy2.ornl.gov (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 49ByvD1Lc3z2TrfG; Wed, 29 Apr 2020 08:46:48 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] [J3] (SC22WG5.6187) RE: [ukfortran] October meeting visa invitation letter To: j3@mailman.j3-fortran.org, WG5 List References: <20200428004737.19A4F9DB145@www.open-std.org> <20200428114456.5CCDA3568A1@www.open-std.org> <999548a1-9f82-418c-b8be-1fd87f94d3be@www.fastmail.com> <20200428172340.851A13568A1@www.open-std.org> <20200428195502.E072C3568BB@www.open-std.org> <5a392c04-ddab-46e6-8024-ae89b8658d29@www.fastmail.com> <20200428225409.F33B13587B3@www.open-std.org> <20200429083749.4E7369DB117@www.open-std.org> <20200429113150.09D839DB117@www.open-std.org> From: "Reuben D. Budiardja" Message-ID: Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2020 08:46:47 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20200429113150.09D839DB117@www.open-std.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-sc22wg5@open-std.org Precedence: bulk On 04/29/2020 07:31 AM, Milan Curcic via J3 wrote: > > GitHub is not a panacea and is not meant to replace live meetings, > calls, or even chat. I see it as "better email for developing software > and documents". It doesn't even mean to replace all email, but only > some. So I don't think doing everything on GitHub is the solution. > However for what I think is a significant fraction of committee work in > the time between the meetings, GitHub can provide powerful productivity > tools. It does not have to be completely one or the other. I can certainly see that ideas can be developed and hashed out between meetings in Github, to a form suitable / complete enough for a "paper" submission to J3-Fortran, which then can be voted on by the committee, or fine-tuned during the meeting. This would be completely organic, whoever wants to join the discussion on Github, can do so. I like that there is a sense of "finality" with submissions and voting via J3-Fortran. I guess I see it as an analog to a scientific paper being sent for review and publication. You can do all your work in the open, pre-publish it, get reviewed by close colleagues, etc, but at the end of the day you'd send it to a refereed journal for final review and publication. In this case it would be J3-Fortran and inclusion to the standard. Some would rather do the work "independently" (i.e. within subgroups), during the meeting time, and/or not on GitHub, and that should be fine as well. I am not sure it's productive to require one way or another, or that everything must be done ahead of time. As was mentioned before, for some the meeting time is probably the only dedicated time one has to work on the standard. Best, Reuben