From owner-sc22wg5@open-std.org Thu Jun 25 06:13:51 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sc22wg5-dom7 Delivered-To: sc22wg5-dom7@www2.open-std.org Received: by www2.open-std.org (Postfix, from userid 521) id 547C9C4596C; Thu, 25 Jun 2009 06:13:51 +0200 (CET DST) X-Original-To: sc22wg5@open-std.org Delivered-To: sc22wg5@open-std.org Received: from mail1.cray.com (mail1.cray.com [136.162.0.111]) by www2.open-std.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A29EC3BB09 for ; Thu, 25 Jun 2009 06:13:25 +0200 (CET DST) Received: from beaver.us.cray.com (beaver.us.cray.com [172.30.74.51]) by mail1.cray.com (8.13.6/8.13.3/gw-5323) with ESMTP id n5P4DN5X022977 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 24 Jun 2009 23:13:23 -0500 (CDT) Received: from CFEXFE01.us.cray.com (CFEXFE01.americas.cray.com [172.30.74.93]) by beaver.us.cray.com (8.13.8/8.13.3/hub-5273) with ESMTP id n5P4DLg2007164; Wed, 24 Jun 2009 23:13:22 -0500 Received: from bill-longs-macbook-pro.local ([192.168.239.57]) by CFEXFE01.us.cray.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Wed, 24 Jun 2009 23:13:21 -0500 Message-ID: <4A42F9EA.1030502@cray.com> Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 23:15:38 -0500 From: Bill Long Reply-To: longb@cray.com Organization: Cray Inc. User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.21 (Macintosh/20090302) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: fortran standards email list for J3 Cc: sc22wg5 Subject: Re: (j3.2006) (SC22WG5.4027) [ukfortran] LOCK/UNLOCK question References: <4A38A3BB.9090208@nag-j.co.jp><4A38B917.8080202@llnl.gov> <4A391682.8060208@cray.com> <061720091627.18164.4A39196C000C05A4000046F422230703729B0A02D29B9B0EBF02019C050C079D0B020A08D2050C070B@att.net> <4A3930E3.8070505@cray.com> <061720091851.25112.4A393B4100015BA20000621822228869349B0A02D29B9B0EBF02019C050C079D0B020A08D2050C070B@att.net> <4A397E50.9010406@nag-j.co.jp> <4A3F9897.8010103@llnl.gov> <4A3FA25D.1050507@cray.com> <4A3FF921.9070703@llnl.gov> <20090622221248.1FEF4C178E5@www2.open-std.org> <20090623084602.88A3EC178E5@www2.open-std.org> <20090624020300.8EE77C178E5@www2.open-std.org> <20090625033421.31AAEC3BB09@www2.open-std.org> In-Reply-To: <20090625033421.31AAEC3BB09@www2.open-std.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Jun 2009 04:13:21.0157 (UTC) FILETIME=[4689FB50:01C9F54B] X-Cray-VirusStatus: clean Sender: owner-sc22wg5@open-std.org Precedence: bulk Malcolm Cohen wrote: > > > N.M. Maclaren wrote: > >> In my experience, the unstructured nature of aliasing control is a more >> important factor, but I agree that getting unstructured parallelism >> controls >> right is error-prone in the hands of experts and completely hopeless >> in the >> hands of non-experts. > > Bill Long wrote: >> I dislike this sort of imperious condescension. While it might be the >> case that some hapless beginners will get things wrong, > > Accusations of "imperious condescension" and implications that fellow > committee members are "hapless beginners" (which sounds condescending in > itself) are out of place on an international mailing list. Your > technical arguments would be stronger if you left this stuff out. I certainly never even thought of Nick in the class of "hapless beginners", nor in the class of "really good programmers". I don't have enough experience to put him in any level. I'm stunned that anyone would have come to this conclusion. What I do object to is Nick's frequent declarations that other programmers are hopeless and incompetent. This is what I meant by "imperious condescension", which I thought would be obvious to everyone. I think it is generally wrong based on my experience, and I think that is what is out of place on an international mailing list. Cheers, Bill > -- Bill Long longb@cray.com Fortran Technical Support & voice: 651-605-9024 Bioinformatics Software Development fax: 651-605-9142 Cray Inc., 1340 Mendota Heights Rd., Mendota Heights, MN, 55120