From owner-sc22wg5@open-std.org Mon Dec 8 19:51:34 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sc22wg5-dom7 Delivered-To: sc22wg5-dom7@www2.open-std.org Received: by www2.open-std.org (Postfix, from userid 521) id 71207C178E0; Mon, 8 Dec 2008 19:51:34 +0100 (CET) X-Original-To: sc22wg5@open-std.org Delivered-To: sc22wg5@open-std.org Received: from proofpoint3.lanl.gov (proofpoint3.lanl.gov [204.121.3.28]) by www2.open-std.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59FACC178DC for ; Mon, 8 Dec 2008 19:51:32 +0100 (CET) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (mailrelay2.lanl.gov [128.165.4.103]) by proofpoint3.lanl.gov (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id mB8IpU3b029505; Mon, 8 Dec 2008 11:51:30 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2B8C15D982F; Mon, 8 Dec 2008 11:51:29 -0700 (MST) X-NIE-2-Virus-Scanner: amavisd-new at mailrelay2.lanl.gov Received: from cic-mail.lanl.gov (cic-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.115]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEC0115D9827; Mon, 8 Dec 2008 11:51:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from soren.lanl.gov (soren.lanl.gov [128.165.148.20]) by cic-mail.lanl.gov (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE116208002; Mon, 8 Dec 2008 11:51:26 -0700 (MST) Cc: WG5 Message-Id: <1FD658F1-2D5E-4F8D-A7B3-09D6DD2A0DAA@lanl.gov> From: Craig Rasmussen To: fortran standards email list for J3 In-Reply-To: <20081208175729.BE32FC178E4@www2.open-std.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Subject: Re: (j3.2006) (SC22WG5.3760) Ballot on the technical content of the TR Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 11:51:26 -0700 References: <20081127193527.EF00DC178D9@www2.open-std.org> <20081208024650.76234C4596C@www2.open-std.org> <20081208175729.BE32FC178E4@www2.open-std.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) X-NIE-2-MailScanner-Information: Please see http://network.lanl.gov/email/virus-scan.php X-NIE-2-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-NIE-2-MailScanner-From: crasmussen@lanl.gov X-Spam-Status: No X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=4.65.7400:2.4.4,1.2.40,4.0.164 definitions=2008-12-08_12:2008-12-05,2008-12-08,2008-12-08 signatures=0 Sender: owner-sc22wg5@open-std.org Precedence: bulk On Dec 8, 2008, at 10:57 AM, Aleksandar Donev wrote: > On Sunday 07 December 2008 18:46, Jim Xia wrote: > >> >> Furthermore allowing >> updates on Fortran descriptors from C programs will likely cause >> safety issues and also be problematic in consistency check by some >> vendors. This becomes a sure way to introduce bugs difficult to >> diagnose. > I do not understand this. You don't want a descriptor TR at all or > not? > You want something that is "safe"---can you propose such a design > please? I find it impossible to imagine how C can pass things to > Fortran by descriptor without being allowed to modify the > descriptor??? > Perhaps you have something else in mind, but the above does not make > sense. HPC developers are currently using libraries that successfully access dope vectors from Fortran now. The primary difficulty is that there is no standard way to do this. Some vendors publish dope vector information and others won't release it as they want to be able to change dope vectors without affecting user code, in which case, the dope vector information must be reverse engineered. The TR will provide a standard way to access dope vectors that is MUCH MORE SAFE than current practice and will not change when a vendor releases a new version of their compiler (oh, I'm sorry, of their processor :-). Regards, Craig