From owner-sc22wg14+sc22wg14-domo2=www.open-std.org@open-std.org Fri Oct 4 13:25:16 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sc22wg14-domo2 Delivered-To: sc22wg14-domo2@www.open-std.org Received: by www.open-std.org (Postfix, from userid 521) id A4D0D3587BB; Fri, 4 Oct 2019 13:25:16 +0200 (CEST) Delivered-To: sc22wg14@open-std.org Received: from mail2-relais-roc.national.inria.fr (mail2-relais-roc.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.83]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by www.open-std.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5742535669C for ; Fri, 4 Oct 2019 13:25:13 +0200 (CEST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.67,256,1566856800"; d="scan'208";a="404735072" Received: from dysnomia.u-strasbg.fr (HELO inria.fr) ([130.79.192.150]) by mail2-relais-roc.national.inria.fr with ESMTP/TLS/AES256-GCM-SHA384; 04 Oct 2019 13:25:13 +0200 Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2019 13:25:12 +0200 From: Jens Gustedt Cc: "sc22wg14@open-std.org" , "cl-c-memory-object-model@lists.cam.ac.uk" Subject: Re: (SC22WG14.17198) terminology: indeterminate value Message-ID: <20191004132512.5779ab43@inria.fr> In-Reply-To: <20191003144005.C3B9A358775@www.open-std.org> References: <20190917212650.D1428358576@www.open-std.org> <20190918085458.71138358704@www.open-std.org> <1569077686.4767.2.camel@med.uni-goettingen.de> <20190921204328.5ab27e0b@inria.fr> <1569095700.5239.4.camel@med.uni-goettingen.de> <20190921230456.1382dc6a@inria.fr> <1569132869.4752.3.camel@med.uni-goettingen.de> <20191003110713.authhl4s66tpsolp@xb27-stretch.fritz.box> <20191003120304.77476358794@www.open-std.org> <20191003121409.i2u3m6hlbzth3zv2@xb27-stretch.fritz.box> <20191003125122.A88853588D9@www.open-std.org> <20191003152137.097b7acd@inria.fr> <20191003140859.8C067356FB7@www.open-std.org> <20191003143047.765D8356DC7@www.open-std.org> <20191003144005.C3B9A358775@www.open-std.org> Organization: inria.fr X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.3 (GTK+ 2.24.32; x86_64-pc-linux-gnu) X-Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAAAXNSR0IArs4c6QAAACRQTFRFERslNjAsLTE9Ok9wUk9TaUs8iWhSrYZkj42Rz6aD3sGZ MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Sig_/rDTBIpxSakPRx_MSFhjQh+v"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Sender: owner-sc22wg14@open-std.org Precedence: bulk --Sig_/rDTBIpxSakPRx_MSFhjQh+v Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello Martin, On Thu, 3 Oct 2019 14:40:01 +0000 "Uecker, Martin" wrote: > My point is that if we want to go into this direction (which > I support), we need to come up with a completely new > model for how this can work and all rules related to > indeterminate and unspecified values then need to be revised.=C2=A0 Looking in all places that talk about indeterminate values is unavoidable, anyhow, if want to move forward in any direction. > This will be a substantial conceptual change and not > some slight rewording or clarification of the > existing rules. I don't think that it is as dramatic, actually. Many of the things that happen when such objects are accessed are already listed under "lvalue conversion". Jens --=20 :: INRIA Nancy Grand Est ::: Camus ::::::: ICube/ICPS ::: :: ::::::::::::::: office Strasbourg : +33 368854536 :: :: :::::::::::::::::::::: gsm France : +33 651400183 :: :: ::::::::::::::: gsm international : +49 15737185122 :: :: http://icube-icps.unistra.fr/index.php/Jens_Gustedt :: --Sig_/rDTBIpxSakPRx_MSFhjQh+v Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: Digitale Signatur von OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iF0EARECAB0WIQSN9stI2OFN1pLljN0P0+hp2tU34gUCXZcsGAAKCRAP0+hp2tU3 4jMhAJ0WTVZCL664NYCmmEsqiHtQaqfEVQCgjhMYOF0B2obMz1WeUn8GhBfRNPw= =1tyA -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/rDTBIpxSakPRx_MSFhjQh+v--